Rob Kearny the best fullback in the world?? what are you nuts?? 2 names Israel Dagg & Kurtley Beale!!! both would run rings round Kearny!!! as he will find out next month in NZ!!!

@Hohepa totally agree!! Kearny would be lucky to break the top 5!!

It’s not rocket science. Not even chess. The pieces move well enough without the coach. Yes England need a good attack coach. A good smart novice that fits in to the dynamic will be better than a “done it all” “should be head”. London Irish attacking game style behind an England attack… Could be very exciting. My worry is England forwards outside set pieces at the breakdown etc

Sounds like another gohist-written article to me, which will no doubt be repudiated in due course by SH! Oh… anfd you Kiwis, if you bothered to watch NH rugby, you’d realize that Rob Kearney is right at the top of the fullback tree, along with Dagg and Beale. Maybe not such a threat on counter, but better in defence and in the air.

Midfield question is an interesting one. Easy to underestimate how much Andy Farrell achieved as such a young coach in the 6 Nations. By the end of the tourney he had made England the best defensive side in the competition, bar none.

How much of that defensive solidity would be lost by reverting to an all-Tigers midfield? Can Anthony Allen assume the role of defensive captain as effectively as Brad Barritt?

There’s a trade-off here, exchanging more ball-playing ability for considerably less defensive expertise. The way modern international rugby is played, I doubt it’s one worth making.

@wiliambishop I have watched lots of NH rugby having I lived in Ireland for 3 years…I never said he wasnt a good fullback I also think hes very good in the 2 areas you mentioned…but for the writer to say he must be the best 15 in the world is just crazy…Dagg & Beale are very good under the highball as well the All Blacks did alot of work in that area before the world cup & it paid off…Kearney might be a better tackler but on attack there is daylight between him & Dagg / Beale & not just on counter attack…both are lethal in their respective teams back attack moves when they are given space by their as skilful inside backs…

@Hohepa. I haven’t got the knock on Beale and Dagg who are both very fine [if occasinally skittish] f/b’s. But I do think Kearney is the best in the world at receiving and pursuing/reclaiming high kicks, and that’s what full-backs spend most of their time doing.

Personally I would rate Dagg and Beale ahead of Kearney, but i agree Kearney has the better skills under the high ball.

If yu are judging people on all round skills though, such as ability under the high ball, counter-attacking, fend, creativity etc…how about Corey Jane? He is effectively a fullback playing wing after all!

By the way I have my own rugby blog if anyone is interested:

http://www.dumptackle.blogspot.com

Dagg and Beale are dangerous in attack but for the complete full back, and on form since the world cup Kearney stands out. He has it all. The best since Latham at his best. We’ll see come Lions time. Halfpenny I would put up there with Dagg and Beale. Agree Allen not ready for England. Manu and Barritt fit the bill for S.Af with Joseph displacing the weaker of them next year to add that attacking menace.

@wiliambishop you’re not knocking Dagg & Beagle then you call them skittish? only in the NH do the fullbacks spend most of their time catching high balls…its not a great idea to kick away your poceesion to teams who have backs & fwds with the skills to punish you for it down here..& Phil isn’t it amazing that Corey has all.those skills & still cant make fullback…says a lot of what is expected from the NZ back 3

RE : Dagg & Beale, I’m just pointing out that they’re not perfect and have their weaknesses, just like Kearney. That should be obvious.

As for your dig at NH rugby, well the South African sides don’t seem to be doing too badly in the SH with their kicking games do they? The Stormers have kicked the most and made fewest linebreaks in super rugby this season, but only lost one game!

I think the AB’s selection of two non-specialist wings at the world cup was very interesting, and it points to the more mature brand of football that’s necessary when the heat really comes on. And let’s face it, both Jane and Kahui were among NZ’s better players at the tournament.

@Hohepa Panapa and @James Marshall Have you been watching Heineken cup???? Fair enough Kearney is not the best but he’s right up there with KB and ID!!! Kearney’s kicking has improved ten fold and he’s playing smart rugby! Your definitely not giving Kearney enough credit.

@William, @Guido yes I follow the Heineken Cup closely and living in the UK am going to the final. Kearny is a good player but not the best fullback in the world. You say he is better under the high ball and defence but what evidence do have to support that. Dagg and Beale make more line breaks, have more try assists and score more tries. Ireland’s defence has never been anything to write home about and they will ship plenty of points in June. @Manuka you are just plain wrong, he’s not the best now and never will be. The best since Latham doesn’t stake up either. An all time great but his career overlapped much of Muliana’s – and you don’t rack up 100 tests, 3 Grand Slams, a Lions clean sweep and a RWC by being anything other than great. You could make a case for either…but the greatest of all time was Cullen.

I live in the UK and watch both hemispheres avidly but I cannot believe people are saying Kearney is the best full back. It’s aa northern hemisphere bias coming out there. He’s an excellent player for sure, but too shine in the Heineken Cup as a back isn’t the same as in the Southern Hemiphere where general skill levels are far higher. People are taking his performances from an average six nationas and 10 minutes of play against Clermont and suddenly he’s better than Beale and Dagg? Come on…

For me the best full back of the last decade has to be Muliaina. He had an allround game which meant that even when he wasn’t making breaks or scoring tries, he was still setting up others. He had incredibly good hands, timing and his positional play was superb. I don’t remember him ever having a bad game.

As for most electrifying full back I would say Cullen. He wasn’t complete in the same way as Muliaina (lacked a kicking game for example), but his counterattacking was unbelievable and the number of times he made ridiculous almost super-human tackles to stop tries was incredible. Sad that he was never able to show his ability at a World Cup at full back. I feel he is completely under-rated in Europe.

http://www.dumptackle.blogspot.com

Those stats don’t mean everything. An AB fullback will always look good. I like players who can perform despite the 14 men being under the cosh. AB fans seem to give all the credit to all their players and all coaches like they somehow all did it single handedly. NZ rugby culture wins it. No question. The players are not all top. When talking individuals just occasionally there are players born elsewhere that are better. Carl Hayman one of the great props ever was not even making starting spot at Toulon at times despite being one of the best in the winning AB team displaced by a guy with few international stats in a team that lost everything. I previously argued Hayman was the best in the world but I was wrong. You can’t really tell till you take the man out of the team. I’d like to see McCaw play for Bristol/Newcastle next season. It’s tough at the bottom.

@Philip. No, it’s not NH bias at all. For those of us who keep tabs one these things consistently, Kearney has been one of the best full-backs in the world ever since the Lions tour of SA in 2009. So to caricature it as ‘10 minutes versus Clermont’ is deliberately crass. He also has a better and longer kicking game than Dagg and Beale.

I would think both Kearney, Ben Foden and Leigh Halfpenny would also be in any All Black or Wallaby squad selected tomorrow. Although you are right that SH skill levels are higher [at least in the three-quarters], I think it’s interesting to note that the successful teams in this year’s Super Rugby competition [Stormers, Bulls, Chiefs and Brumbies] have a strong NH/South African influence in their patterns of play. The Stormers play very much like Saracens, and they’ve been [along with the Chiefs] the best in Super rugby this year.

I’d rate Chris Latham above Mils Muliaina – a more complete full-back in my view, although you’d be happy with either in your fantasy team of the past decade…

@Manuka – Dagg is better it doesn’t matter where he is from. Your argument about Hayman is way off the mark. Tighthead is where a scrum and team start and no matter how good the other 14 are he will get shown up. Hayman dominated in the position for a long time at the highest level and has since been surpassed. The fact a lousy French club team preferred somone else doesn’t prove anything – even aside from the fact he was just there for a very well paid holiday.

Dagg is a very good attacking player. Leathal. He’s not a complete 15 that’s all. You could argue he’s more useful than a complete 15 so who cares. Class is class. I’d be suprised if he remained at 15 for his full career… He’s a winger to me. And Kearney is my world 15 at 15. Beale looks like he’s heading for 10 or utility back and may end up as an Ozzie James Hook if his club messes with him too much.

@wiliambishop …you are nuts if you think Kearney, Foden or Halfpenny would be selected in the All Blacks selected tomorow or any day because they wouldnt. Right behind Dagg is Isaia Toeava & 2 up and comers in Andre Taylor (joint current top try scorer in the comp right now) from the Hurricanes & Robbie Robertson from the Chiefs who was fullback for NZ Maori team that beat both Ireland & England. The 3 NZ teams the Chiefs, Crusaders & Highlanders in the top 6 of the Super XV dont have any NH/SA influence. It doesnt matter who wins the Super XV or Heineken Cup because it doesnt translate to who will win at test level beacuse the players selected in the National team dont just come from the winning team. @JamesMarshall you left out one more of Mils’s accomplishments…a Commonwealth Games Gold medal for 7s…Hes the man :)

There we go again. He’s in the best team therefore he’s the best player. I’m Suprised you need a selection process in NZ. Just run an algorithm and it will churn out stats that select the AB team. Presumably that would beat a best of the rest of the world team because they have the best 3 players in the world in every position.

By the way Kearney can place kick and drop goal too. If Dagg could do that Dan Carter would be sure in at 10 for Crusaders and ABs. Complete 15s take pressure off their 10s when needed.

@Hohepa – you’re spot on again. I’d take both of those guys over Kearny 10 times out of 10 and Ben Smith and Jane. As for Mils we’ve forgotten to mention his NPCs, Super 12 and Ranfurly Shield:) @William – NZ teams play a NZ style. Nothing NH about it. @Manuka – fancy that eh?? The best players playing for the best team!! Who would of thought it. We are truly blessed to have so many great players and that’s what makes a great team. They prove themselves as the best players in their school, club, provincial and super teams (whether good or bad) and only then are they even looked at by the All Black selectors. We don’t need algorithms we just need eyes. Our top 3 have proven they are good enough to beat the world. Just ask the 1992 World XV, the 2005 Lions and look at our 2006 team and the they made week to week and still won.

Apologies for typo above: Meant to say “the changes they made week to week and still won.” Hand on heart – there is not a single home nations player in my world XV. Not even a reserve.

@Manuka now you are just looking foolish. Dagg can and does do both if required as he has proven at Hawkes Bay. Our 10s are so much better than yours we don’t need to worry about that.

@Hohepa. I beg to differ. Toeava is still unproven at Test level despite numerous chances to establsih himself, which is why the AB selectors have tended to put him on the wing – or leave him out altogether for the crunch games… Andre Taylor is certainly promising but again, he ain’t got any pelts on his pony yet…

Well, the Super 15 is as good an indicator of the talent coming through, and most of that talent on the evidence available is in South Africa. I also think the Aussies and Kiwis are afraid of the South Africans, because of their player base and greater financial resources. Back in 2009 they engineered a rule change because no-one at the time could live with the Bulls or even the Sharks – and that superiority was translating into the NT’s. Remember the Bulls stuffing the Chiefs by over 60 points in one Super Rugby final?

I strongly suspect, with Graham Henry and Wayne Smith out of the picture, that South Africa will come to the fore again in the Rugby Championship.

I am an Aussie and i dont think you could call Beale, Dagg or Kearney the best in the world. They all have strengths and weaknesses that effectively cancel each other out. Beale can set up tries and spot an opportunity better than any in my opinion. Dagg runs unbelievable lines and has the strength in his hips to bump players off when it does not appear possible, and Kearney has an amazing kicking and defensive game, better than KB and Dagg. Beale chip kicks too much, Dagg cant control his massive boot too often for my liking and Kearney needs to add another 5-10% to his attacking game, whilst he is a decent attacker he is not in the same league as the other 2. They all have different attributes and it would depend on how your team plays as to which one you would select. As for Latham, Mils and Cullen – no question!!! Latham and Cullen are without peer – i honestly cant split them. Mils was good but not quite at their level. If i had to choose one in my XV of the last 15 years i would take Latho only because he was world xv in the aussie side! makes you wonder what he could have been like in the All Blacks.

Yes yes, ABs have better players than everyone. Well done. I’ll give you that and that Dagg is the complete 15 at Hawkes Bay level.

Sorry William but I’ve got to disagree with you again. NZ is not “afraid” of the South Africans. They are our oldest and most respected rival and won two World Cups before we did. For a variety of reasons we did not win a series against them until 1956 and a series in South Africa until 1996. However you are being very selective with your facts. That 2009 Bulls team was superb (Steyne, Du Preez, Botha, Matfield, Spies, Habana et al.) and formed the backbone of their 2009 Tri Nations winning team…but the All Blacks won the Tri Nations in 2005, 2006, 2007,2008 and 2010 and as we all know the Crusaders are consisntently the best team in Super Rugby. By your logic they should be afraid of NZ. They aren’t and the mutual respect goes both ways. Thanks Manuka yes Dagg is the complete fullback at club, provincial, super and test level – just what you would expect from the world’s best fullback.

@James. Thanks for proving my point James by your omissions. That point is that the South Africans have never [at least to my knowledge] tried to drive changes in the law-making process as New Zealand and Australia do consistently. Clearly the fact that the Bulls won three out of four Super rugby titles 2007-2010 – and there were two all SA finals in that period – plus the world cup win in 2007, concerned the NZRFU and the ARU. That’s why the laws were ‘adjusted’ in ways that made SA sides less effective.

The truth is that, although the AB’s have great charisma throughout the global game, financially the game is on a better footing in Europe and in the Republic. The All Blacks and Wallabies have to win to attract the money into the domestic game, the South Africans and Europeans don’t. 80,000 people will continue to turn up to watch a Premiership club game at Twickenham regardless of England’s NT status.

And yes, I do think SA would have beaten the AB’s if they’d met at the 2007 world cup.

@JamesMarshall now I’m on your side. ABs afraid of S.Af ! Get out of here! Why? Love it when S.Af start thinking they’re as good as ABs… Northern Hem always think they have a chance v Saf. V ABs they’re half beaten before the kick off. ABs are most feared despite SAf intimidation tactics. Daggs right up there with Van Gisbergen at 15…

Allrighty, after reading these comments I had to jump in here. It’s get a little tedious listening to all this NH vs SH crap. The two areas play very different styles of rugby so it’s going to be hard to properly compare them.

But @Manuka; you say that any AB full back looks good because of the team he’s in. That sounds like playing in a good team is detrimental, and people who are less fortunate are actually better players? How does that work? If you’re a good player in average team, you’ll stand out through your actions. For a star to stand out in a team of stars, wouldn’t they have to be bloody brilliant to start with?

As for @William, you mentioned that NZ and Aus teams have to win to pull money into the area.. While I agree with that, you see it as a negative but I see it as a positive. Less financially sound regions play with more conviction than their richer counterparts. You can see it in every level of rugby, from high school to club, to NPC and onwards. To say that NZ and Aus are afraid of South Africa is a bit silly. There is a huge amount of respect between all three teams. Because if any of the teams front up with less than their best effort, their opponent will thrash them. And as for the European and SA regions having more money.. While the South African’s have enjoyed some periods of utter dominance in the world of rugby, there just isn’t a winning record like the All Blacks. We have less money, less of a talent pool, and we still win. More often than anybody else.

@Corey. Thanks for ‘jumping in’. The point I was making was actually quite simple – and it’s not that NZ was afraid of SA as a rugby opponent on the field. The fear exists on the political level and as I pointed out, expresses itself through law-making changes. Because the NZ and Australian unions have so little cash compared to their NH counterparts, they have to make sure that the rugby they finance provides a winning spectacle, to keep attracting bums to seats. One of the ways of doing that is to change the laws so you keep winning…

@Manuka Wood I love the way you say SA “think”. I think you are the one thinking we “think” that. Now we are in the BS territory of mind reading and presumptions. The AB’s the arch enemy. They set the standards and the rest follow. Our goal and ambition is to go out and be competitive. Professional rugby players are not afraid of other players. If he was he would not have been a professional player. They have respect for each other. But not afraid. Anyways as soon as that whistle goes adrenalin takes over and every thought goes out the window. We had some of the most entertaining games against the AB’s and we had some poor ones as well. But I have never seen a poor AB side. I think that do not exist. When we have beaten them and 3 or 4 times in one year we were the better team. We were on better form playing our natural game and had a squad that played a lot of matches together. They were so in “click” that PdV manage a couple of wins in NZ with them.

But do not think for 1 moment we are under the illusion that we have better players and we think they are Gods gift to rugby. No. I do not think NZ think that as well because sitting with a team full of stars do not equal wins. I think NZ knows that better than anyone else.1 Thing I do know a game between the 3 SH nations are never a guaranteed win for any of them. Me as a SA supporter have a hard time to call a winner or say for certain who is going to win. I think NZ and Aus supporters will feel the same. How many times have we seen a team who looks better on paper and oozes with skill lose against a team playing with determination and giving 300 percent for 80 minutes?

Simon, England will mostly under-achieve thro not having a proper rep stage between club & country. Ponsonby(NZ), Villagers(SA)& Randwick (OZ) are examples of clubs who would hold their own in the Premiership yet England has nothing to act as a stepping-stone. The 12 Prem clubs are not good enough to obviate the need for such a stage. Plus the Prem has totally isolated itself from the rest of Eng rugby. No Prem player sets foot on the same pitch as a player below that lge. Yet World Cup winners Hore, Weepu & Jane (among others) played in the ITM Cup just before the World Cup with & against some players with full-time jobs & who play most of their rugby at amateur clubs. Till Eng rugby has a rep stage so that players from clubs like your own Esher can progress without leaving, England will mainly under-achieve – regardless of whether Wayne Smith, Nick Mallett or others come here.

Now the rugby championship is over & Ireland (with Kearney in it) have been dispatched by a record score…I rest my case about Israel Dagg. Great under the high ball & even took over the goal kicking against Ireland!!!! thats outside his normal setting up & scoring tries.